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NATO Review
BLOOD BROTHERS?
Why Lithuanians feel Ukraine’s pain
...and how they avoided the same fate
24:02 min
00.35 – Paul King – voice-over
People of Lithuania and Ukraine have a long shared history. Centuries ago, they even formed one of Europe’s biggest countries together and more recently in the last twenty-five years, both have had revolutions. But the revolutions’ results have proved very different. Lithuania, for example, started 2015 as part of the Eurozone with a reviving economy and plans to beef up its NATO presence. Ukraine, however, started the year with a war raging in its east, a bankrupt economy and over half a million Ukrainians refugees in their own country. So why did these countries paths turn out so differently, and how close did Lithuania come to the same fate as Ukraine?
01.19 – Paul King – voice-over
To understand the difference, we have to first understand look at what happened in Lithuania. On March 11th 1990, Lithuania declared its independence from the Soviet Union. Negotiations with Moscow on recognition of the state continued until, in January 1991, the Soviet Union sent in armed forces to put down the people’s revolution.
01.43 – Roland Kaćinskas – Political Director, Ministry of Foreign Affairs
That night, fourteen people were killed and more than a thousand injured. I was one of those students who stood among many, many other thousand people, who stood that night and many, many other nights afterwards in front of the parliament building.
02.01 – Paul King
The Lithuanians fought back, with songs.
02.05 – Roland Kaćinskas – Political Director, Ministry of Foreign Affairs
And then I say defending... this defence consisted mainly of singing songs, praying the rosary or erecting the barricades.
02.20 – Paul King
This may look like just another singsong but it is a key part of the Lithuanian struggle for independence. When the tanks rolled into Vilnius over 20 years ago, the advice from the independence leader was sing. Sing, no fighting, no aggression, just sing.
02.39 – Paul King – voice-over
The man who gave that advice was the independence leader Vytautas Landsbergis. For him, this wasn’t a struggle to take on the whole Soviet system, it was the Lithuanians saying they no longer wanted to live in the Soviet bloc, an arrangement which had been decided under the Nazi-Soviet Pact 50 years beforehand.
03.00 – Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
If you want to keep the old Soviet Union, it is your business. We are independent in spirit, in law, in international law, in our eyes, and we are doing it.
03.15 – Paul King – voice-over
Instead of following its new open glasnost approach, Moscow gave Lithuania a traditional and severe reproach. When the Soviet forces attacked Lithuania in 1991, they headed for the parliament as well as the TV tower and studio. The aim was to take down those who stood for freedom and their voices. Eglie Bucalaite was broadcasting to the nation that night as the violence unfolded.
03.41 – Paul King
This is the studio that Eglie was broadcasting from that day in 1991. And this is the door that Soviet forces kicked down.
03.52 – Eglie Bucalaite - Newsreader (interpreter voice-over)
I do not think anybody was thinking about their own safety at that time. The only moment when it wasn’t clear whether I will survive or not, were those minutes when I saw those soldiers in uniforms and masks walking in the corridors and I was sitting in the studio. Then the thought occurred to me, whether this is the end of my life and how simple and unexpected everything may end.
04.21 – Paul King – voice-over
This was a key moment. Control of information was vital to the Soviets, especially in fighting the revolution.
04.29 – Man in the street 1 (interpreter voice-over)
Soviet times were terrifying. I could listen to the anthem only on American radio. We’ll find a Lithuanian transmission on radio. When the anthem was being playing, I would put it on the highest volume so it could be heard in the whole house.
05.00 – Eglie Bucalaite - Newsreader (interpreter voice-over)
The premises were occupied by a military television, which was making broadcasts of a completely opposite information. A Russian propaganda, which would make us laugh today, if nothing would be happening in Ukraine. In fact, we see the same thing.
05.18 – Paul King – voice-over
The attack on the TV stations led to 14 deaths but soon, Soviet tactics escalated to something even more sinister.
05.26 – Paul King
On July 31st 1991, there were 8 men working in this customs hut on the Lithuanian border. The hut was suddenly ambushed by Russian forces from the woods. They wore sneakers so as not to be heard as they approached the hut. They burst into the hut and forced all 8 men who were working here onto the floor in this patch here, and then one by one, shot each in the back of the head, execution style, with a silenced gun. These 7 men, some of them as young as 20, all died instantly. There was only one survivor who can still tell the story today, and that man is Tomas Šernas.
06.10 – Tomas Šernas – Former Lithuanian customs officer (interpreter voice-over)
This place resembled the Ukrainian Maidan, but nobody was singing. We had to work and there were no crowds like in front of the parliament, just 7 or 8 people situated by a forest without any means of telecommunication.
When I was working, I was sitting behind that desk. It was an early morning, two hours till sunrise. The trailer was standing where those crosses are placed. I heard a strange noise, I raised my eyes and I saw a man running and holding a gun.
They were Russians wearing Russian uniforms which didn’t have any distinctive signs, and they were without military shoes, they were wearing sneakers. This allowed them to sneak in silently during the night. The lights were turned off. We were told to lay down on the ground. When they started shooting, there was no sound, so they died silently.
A gun had a silencer, so there was no sound of a shooting. They didn’t say anything. They were only shooting them in their heads. The same was done to me.
07.50 – Paul King – voice-over
The attack took place on Lithuania’s border with Belarus and even today, the mentalities on either side of the border remain starkly different.
07.59 – Paul King
We’re here on the Lithuanian border, Lithuania on this side and Belarus over there. But this is more than just a geographical divide, this is an ideological divide. On this side, the European Union, on the other side, what’s been called the last dictatorship of Europe, and now we’re going to show you what it’s like.
08.24 – Paul King – voice-over
Belarus has spent the twenty-five years since the end of the Soviet Union remaining a close ally of Russia, politically and economically. By not opposing Russia, it’s benefited from cheap oil and gas deals. Ukraine has been regularly punished since 1991 by Moscow if it made moves towards Europe. And the results are clear in the economy. Lithuania got similar treatment when it dared challenge Moscow before.
08.50 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
We were challenged in the beginning of the ‘90s, maybe you do not remember, but I do. There were empty streets, there was no gas and no cars, it was wintertime I remember the cold in the flats. It was kind of lesson to us because we would like to be independent so okay, we can be independent and this is the price.
09.09 – Paul King – voice-over
Lithuania turned this to its advantage.
09.13 – Dalia Grybauskaitė – President of Lithuania
In these eight months, we were able to turn our economy towards the West and in eight months, we started to trade with the West, practically two-thirds of our economy.
09.24 – Paul King – voice-over
Today, Lithuania leads the calls for ensuring that sanctions are imposed on Russia for its actions in Ukraine, even though these sanctions hurt their economy.
09.34 – Nerijus Maliukevičius – Institute of International Relations and Political Science
Being next to Russia, we are suffering the most from the sanctions. Our agriculture sector, our transport sector, they are suffering every day and despite that fact, we are still being one of the biggest proponents of the sanctions because that’s the only way how you can stop aggression, how you can send very strong messages to the Russian leadership.
09.56 – Paul King – voice-over
The reaction of Moscow has been similar to both Lithuania and Ukraine’s uprising. And it may be because in both 1991 and today, the Russian economy was in trouble.
10.07 – Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
We realised very well that Soviet Union as such is bankrupt. And they realised, therefore they wanted to manipulate with some reforms, but how to save the empire.
10.29 – Paul King – voice-over
Nationalism was a distraction. And it is the same today.
10.33 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
The economy’s ruined, frankly. No investments, no perspectives. In addition, oil prices even bit improved but not yet to the perfect so to say level. So the situation’s really bad. You can refer to the nationalism, but how many times you can do that? This channel Russia Today, or I’m calling Russia Yesterday, or Russian-speaking channels, this is terrible propaganda. Sometimes it’s misinterpreted as freedom of speech. If Goebbels was journalist, then I’m giving up.
11.14 - Paul King – voice-over
But just as the attacks on both revolutions are similar, so has the unity of the people fighting for those revolutions.
11.20 – Roland Kaćinskas – Political Director, Ministry of Foreign Affairs
We have to stand together with Ukraine and not only we as Lithuanians, but I think the whole Europe has to do so because what’s happening in Ukraine is not only about Ukraine, as it wasn’t only about Lithuania.
11.35 - Paul King
2018 will be the 100th anniversary of Lithuania’s declaration of independence. But 2015 is an important year too because Lithuania joined the Eurozone, it adopted the euro and this is a new Lithuanian euro coin.
11.51 - Paul King – voice-over
Sitting at the heart of the EU is one thing, but Lithuania knows that convincing some partners that compromising with Russia doesn’t work, will be just as difficult.
12.02 - Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
Looking around such solid international institutions, big budgets, a lot of ambitions, 21st century, we can do nothing when European country invading other neighbouring country, and we can do nothing, just statements of concern. Is it not strange for you? For me it is.
12.21 – Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
What is compromise? They are always, as in our case in 1990, they demanded capitulation, calling it compromise.
12.36 - Paul King – voice-over
He remembers that despite the Soviet Union making the right noises in public, behind the scenes, Lithuanian leaders were being threatened.
12.44 – Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
You will never be given your independence, they were words of Gorbachev to me. Be reasonable, it is unrealistic, come to real matters. We will give you more autonomy. Now you are given 7 % of your national income in currency, 7 %. We will give you 20, be happy. For normal people and for... why not 100, it's our profit.
13.23 - Paul King – voice-over
And for some, just engaging in talks over concessions for Russian aggression in Ukraine actually makes the situation worse.
13.30 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
I won’t say that we are responsible, we are not attacking Ukraine, we’re not invading that country. But by being passive, or by being not consistent, we are contributing to the escalation.
13.43 – Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
Why we are talking today openly, and we see that what is on-going is the Munich 2, the sell-out of Ukraine. I could remind the advice of one old woman in a Lithuanian village. She said: Boys, don’t make even a little step back because they will put their foot on this place where was your feet.
14.20 - Paul King – voice-over
Worse still, whilst the world unites against terrorism, some feel that terrorist tactics are now a Moscow tool.
14.28 – Dalia Grybauskaitė – President of Lithuania
If you have professional military without identification signs and the flag, how you call it, of course it is professional and we know that it is Russian military but they behave as terrorists.
14.40 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
Victims are victims if they are civilians. I’m always saying this example because I took part in the march in Paris, this ‘Je suis Charlie', and I marched together with all colleagues defending, you know, freedom of speech. There were twice more victims per day than in Paris at that time so maybe not correct to compare because every victim is one too many.
15.06 – Paul King – voice-over
And it is the ideology in the Kremlin that worries many the most. It reflects a resurgent nationalistic country while the Kremlin says it needs to protect Russians.
15.17 - Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
Russia is a state which has no borders, that is to be realised. Even east to Ukraine, they still suffer that there is a border between Baltic states and Russia, and they don’t have even with Estonia a state border.
15.32 – Paul King – voice-over
It can be as simple as saying that Russian-speakers need protection.
15.36 - Vytautas Landsbergis -– Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
We have many English-speakers everywhere in the world and maybe the United Kingdom may come to India back. They are English-speakers, maybe they suffer.
15.51 - Paul King – voice-over
Perhaps the different viewpoints are due to different definitions. Does democracy mean the same in Russia as it does in the West?
16.00 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
They have a special democracy. Their democracy is different. It’s specific Russian democracy.
16.07 - Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
In Western meaning, partnership is doing something together for common good, common benefit. In Eastern Russian understanding, partnership is a game in which your partner is to be put on his knees.
16.29 – Paul King – voice-over
So what do they recommend that the West do in the face of Putin's aggression?
16.35 - Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
My advice is not to listen what he says. Look what he makes, look at the action. They are still talking. Oh, what he said; what he has said today; what he has said yesterday; there is a difference.
16.54 – Paul King – voice-over
The irony is that Ukraine had its chance to turn to the West by signing an EU association agreement during Lithuania’s EU presidency. President Yanukovych had the chance to break with the aggression of an unpredictable Russian neighbour. But that’s not how things worked out.
17.10 – Paul King
And it’s that entrance behind me where the story comes full circle. It was there that the EU presidency that was held by Lithuania, the first Baltic state to have that presidency, had arranged for a meeting where the association agreement with Ukraine was going to be signed by former president of Ukraine Yanukovych. He arrived but refused to sign the agreement under pressure from the Kremlin and it was that refusal that led to the Euromaidan protests.
17.42 – Paul King – voice-over
Another irony is that a Lithuanian, Aivaras Abromavicius, is minister for economic development and trade in the new government, which was formed after Russian-speaking ex-President Yanukovych ran away to live in Russia. By contrast, in Lithuania, the leaders and the people stayed united. But what if their common vision of a Lithuania in Europe had not held?
18.06 – Paul King
What would be Lithuania’s position today if it hadn’t joined NATO?
18.11 – Dalia Grybauskaitė – President of Lithuania
You know, I don’t even want to think about it. I only can thank God that the decision of our nation 25 years ago was for the freedom and we became the members of NATO and the European Union, and for us it is new chance of history, and we took it.
18.33 – Paul King
And so you have no idea about how events could have developed if...
18.38 – Dalia Grybauskaitė – President of Lithuania
Don’t even want to think about it.
18.41 – Paul King - voice-over
It’s clear that the path that Lithuania took is possibly the only one that can guarantee the country’s safety.
18.48 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
Again, recalling 2008, Georgia, they were not members of NATO. We have a result. Ukraine, a big country in the middle of Europe, they are not members of NATO, we have a result. This is the difference.
19.00 – Paul King - voice-over
But the best measure of how safe people feel is simply to ask them. So we did.
19.05 – Paul King
Do you feel that Lithuania is safe today?
19.10 – Man in the street 2
I think yes.
19.11 – Woman in the street 1
Yes, still quite safe. Well, maybe not 100 %, but...
19.16 – Paul King
Ok. And why is it safe?
19.20 – Man in the street 2
Because we’re in NATO.
19.22 – Paul King
Because you’re in NATO?
19.23 – Man in the street 2
Yes, I think so.
19.25 – Woman in the street 1
At least, today I spoke with my parents and we said: Thank God we’re still not in such a situation, we're just happy for this moment. I hope that it will not happen here like in the east.
19.38 – Man in the street 3
Ok, I feel quite good. I know that the situation in the east is very difficult but because of NATO, I feel very good. Yeah, I remember the Soviet Union and I'm happy now that we are in the opposite side right now.
20.03 – Paul King – voice-over
And what was the feeling when Ukraine’s revolution and subsequent battle started last year?
20.09 - Dalia Grybauskaitė – President of Lithuania
I felt pity for our other neighbours who practically lost these twenty-five years of their independence after the Soviet system was collapsing, like Ukraine.
20.18 – Paul King – voice-over
For some, it goes beyond words of encouragement. For some, it provides an opportunity to play a part in a bid for freedom that they missed in 1991. Žana Puodžius has been helping volunteers fighting against Russian-backed rebels in Ukraine, from Donetsk to Debal’tseve.
20.36 – Žana Puodžius – Actress and activist
During the Ukraine, I understood what happened at my country. I was very little, I didn’t remember it. And it was just history, I know it, we learnt in the school and so on, but I didn’t have real emotion about this and in Ukraine I started to understand what happened in our country, very deep.
21.01 – Paul King – voice-over
Even for those who were around in 1991, Ukraine's battles made them realize how close they came to the same that fate.
21.09 - Eglie Bucalaite - Newsreader (interpreter voice-over)
Yes, this really reminds me of those days and it strikes me that we are very lucky. I make a comparison with everything that is happening in Ukraine now. It wasn’t easy, it was really hard, I cannot say that we have escaped from the Soviet Union easily, without any damages, without any sacrifices. But when I see what is happening now, how long it lasts and how much it costs, it is hard to believe and I feel an endless joy that we didn’t have such an ending in Lithuania and that we have been free for years.
21.42 – Paul King - voice-over
Lithuania provided many warnings to its European partners over recent years. But these were often dismissed as being over cautious. Today, Lithuania can confidently say it called the situation right.
21.55 – Nerijus Aleksiejūnas, Diplomat, Lithuania EU Presidency Leadership
We were talking ten years ago that we need to look to Russia through a different angle, and now it seems that we are right about our understanding. We were right about our analysis of Russia, about the internal processes in Russia. And now there is also an additional argument why people in Europe now listen much more carefully to what we are saying.
22.20 – Paul King - voice-over
And there are deeper lessons for us all: that freedom can never be taken for granted.
22.25 – Roland Kaćinskas – Minister of Foreign Affairs of Lithuania
I think it was President Reagan who said that freedom is only one generation away from extinction. So every generation has to do its work.
22.36 – Vytautas Landsbergis – Former Lithuanian head of state and independence leader
Freedom is always contested, it’s never granted.
22.41 - Paul King - voice-over
And that the joy from securing freedom should never be forgotten.
22.43 – Linas Linkevičius – Minister of Foreign Affairs
We made the right decision to join NATO and the European Union. That’s the first point I want to mention. In those days I was defence minister, I remember the accession process, all these emotions during the very day of membership. When I was in Washington and I received a call from my duty officer that Belgian jets crossed our airspace and were going to land in our airbase to conduct their policing. It was a few hours before the moment of membership, literally speaking. It's very difficult to explain what were the feelings. It was something very, very special. And these feelings are still quite strong.
23.27 – Dalia Grybauskaitė – President of Lithuania
I felt proud that we managed to do what we did in proper time, that we knew our neighbour and we knew what we need to do because of our knowledge of this neighbour, and that we are on the right side of history today. And it is a huge luck for our nation.
23.49 – Paul King - voice-over
It’s a luck that’s not shared by Ukraine, at least, not yet.
FINAL CREDITS
Written and presented by
Paul King
Camera
Ruth Owen
Justas Puluikis
Lukas Motiejūnas
Principal Editor
Chris Riley
Marketing
Kevin Prager
Jeff Holden
Footage
LRT
ITN Source
Special thanks to
The Office of the Lithuanian President
Lithuanian Ministry of Foreign Affairs
Marijus Neliupšis
Laura Tautvaišaitė
Jolanta Tarasevičienė
Project coordinator
Marcela Zelnickova
Producer
Luca Fazzuoli
Video Editor
Pieter Claes
Director
Paul King
A NATO Review magazine production.
The views presented in this film do not necessarily reflect those of NATO or of its member states.
| Date Taken: | 03.11.2015 |
| Date Posted: | 03.11.2015 17:47 |
| Story ID: | 156681 |
| Location: | LT |
| Web Views: | 334 |
| Downloads: | 0 |
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